C.C. Sabathia: Overrated

[Pizza The Hutt!]

I don't see why everyone thinks he is (or will become) one of the best lefties in baseball. I just don't see it. He's slightly above average, yes, but only once in his career has he had an ERA below 4.10, and that was just because he got very, very lucky. His hits allowed/9IP remained about the same and his strikeouts dropped - no reason to expect a lower ERA. He did walk 22 less batters, yes, but this was also in a much smaller amount of innings, and 22 less walks wouldn't normally predict a drop in ERA of about .8. Although Sabathia does throw hard, he's never been a big strike-out guy since his rookie year; in fact, his K's have declined every year since then. He managed to win 17 wins because of fantastic run support. Everyone tells me that one of these years, C.C. will suddenly transform into Sandy Koufax. He doesn't strike out anybody, he gives up almost as many hits as innings pitched every year, and although his control isn't horrible, it's slightly below average at best. Why does he get so much love?

[Special_K19]

I don't know of anyone who considers a top lefty, a couple of years ago I knew plenty who thought he had the potential to be one of the top ones, but now he's slated to be a solid #2 or 3 guy in the rotation. There's two things to keep in mind about C.C. 1) He's 24 and already has 50+ career wins, not many pitchers are major league ready at that age let alone have already established themselves as a solid pitcher. He's still learning and trying to develop pitches other than his fastball, which is why his K's have decreased, he knows at his size he can't be a flamethrower for years on end. And that leads to point #2: his weight. Until he gets it under control he'll never dominate. Alledgedly his weight is on the downward swing this offseason, so we'll see how that affects him on the mound. But in a couple of years if he controls his weight he could be very dependable and still might turn into a dominant lefty.

[ORANGEnation]

Wow, you are being way too hard on the young man. At 24 he has been asked to lead a team in the rebuilding process over the past few years... most pitchers aren't even ready for the majors at 24. He has an excellent fastball, very good slider, and solid change, and he's still learning how to pitch to hitters.

I had CC pegged as a breakthrough candidate in '04. While the statline did not prove it, I saw great things in the games I watched. Remember that he got a no decision in like the first 2 or 3 games of the year when any decent bullpen would have nailed down the wins for him. Also, he had stretches of two or three great outings in a row, only to backtrack when a nagging injury put him out for a few games. He was throwing to essentially a rookie catcher, and not a great defensive one at that.

The only thing I agree with you on is that he is not a top lefty YET. However, few lefties have an equal mix of his production and potential.

[PissedPrincess]

No offense, but anyone who thinks C.C. is over-rated is a moron. :)

[rockin500]

good pitcher yes. great pitcher, no.

K has it right that he will be (and is) a solid #2 starter and thats not exactly a bad thing, now is it?

[ORANGEnation]

I understand your immediate outlook Rockin500, at the very moment he is a good, not great pitcher. However, I totally disagree with the assessment that he is only going to top out as a #2. He's already a very solid #2, but in the ace's role. Do you really think a 24 year old, with a rocket arm, and biting breaking ball, on an improving team, can't improve by a lot?

I think the real misconception here is that, I personally haven't heard of a ton of people talk about this guy like he is Randy Johnson. What I HAVE heard is a lot of people talk about him as perhaps the game's NEXT dominating lefty, and rightly so given his tools.

[Burkett03]

WOWWWW OVERRATED??? ARE U FREAKIN SERIOUS....HES SOOOO GOOD HES SO YOUNG MAN GIVE HIM A BREAK

[rockin500]

I understand your immediate outlook Rockin500, at the very moment he is a good, not great pitcher. However, I totally disagree with the assessment that he is only going to top out as a #2. He's already a very solid #2, but in the ace's role. Do you really think a 24 year old, with a rocket arm, and biting breaking ball, on an improving team, can't improve by a lot?

I think the real misconception here is that, I personally haven't heard of a ton of people talk about this guy like he is Randy Johnson. What I HAVE heard is a lot of people talk about him as perhaps the game's NEXT dominating lefty, and rightly so given his tools.
i do worry about his size affecting him at some point. Its not necessarily his weight as its the combined weight and height. Thats the only reason why I'm not sure of him reaching solid #1. well, actually, I dont know that #1 and #2 can really be distinguished on a lot of teams, so he may actually be that good. On the Indians, he will be definitely a good #1. Are you confused yet? Because i sure am! :eek:

he's better than Fatman Colon, thats for damned sure. and i DONT consider colon a #1 starter.