4/10/05: She-ca-go/Twins

[Timberwolf]

Twins will try to avoid being swept by the She-ca-go on ESPN tonight. America will be watching since it's the Twins first Sunday night appearance since couple of years ago when the Twins played the Red Sox at the Dome.

ESPN got a very good matchup tonight as two of the best pitchers in the AL and in baseball sqaure off. For She-ca-go, it will be that jackass Mark Buherle on the mound tonight. I don't care for him especially for his comments on the Twins in September where he felt the team was not playoff-worthy or how the Twins would get swept by NY or how he whined about Torii's hit towards Jamie Burke. I am pretty sure it was him that commented about how the Twins celebrate as if they were a huge part of the 1991 success. It was so fun to see Mark got rocked in September and it couldn't happen to a nicer guy like Mark when he was the pitcher in the mound on the night the Twins clinched the AL Central last year. If there are two guys I don't care for in the division, it's Buherle and the gangsta, C.C. Sabathia. For the Twins, it will be the Johan Cy-tana. It will be his first home start of the year. Hopefully, he can one-up Buherle.

I personally expect some beanballs and brawls. I expect Buherle to go throw a pitch at Torii's head tonight. I really do. I don't think he or the Whiney Sux are over Torii's plummeling of Burke. They still want retribution so we will see.

This is a big game. I sure don't want to see the Twins get swept by those punks.

Buherle vs. Santana

[LesPaul]

is this the Yankees-Sox forum?? didnt realize so much resentment existed between the Twins and Chicago White Sox... :notme:

[Chisox73]

is this the Yankees-Sox forum?? didnt realize so much resentment existed between the Twins and Chicago White Sox... :notme:

He needs to let it go.It's a new season here.I'm looking forward to some good baseball between the 2 teams.

[LesPaul]

He needs to let it go.It's a new season here.I'm looking forward to some good baseball between the 2 teams.


that has been the funnest thing about the last few seasons; watching how everything sorts out and how the cards fall for everyone. always plenty of good ball at the start and down the stretch. :thumbsup: heres to another good one.

[Chisox73]

Good luck to your team Les. :thumbsup:

This will be a nice matchup. The best rivalry that no one has heard of. :)

[Baseball Guru]

The best rivalry that no one has heard of. :)


Agreed:thumbsup:

One of the top 5 in baseball IMO..

[Timberwolf]

Johan is Chicago's Daddy right now.

[Timberwolf]

is this the Yankees-Sox forum?? didnt realize so much resentment existed between the Twins and Chicago White Sox... :notme:

You must be kidding me. There has been resentment between both teams going back to 2001. The hatred began from there. It started when couple of White Sox players sneering at the Twins for taking the series in April of 2001. Then guys like Buherle, Kelly Wunsch, Keith Foulke, Frank Thomas, Jose Valentin are went out of their way to disparage the Twins all year long. I guess those guys were frustrated that winning the AL Central wasn't going to be that easy for them as they thought it was so they went out of their way to go degrade the Twins.

Then in 2002, you got Ray Durham opening his mouth by saying that he could not see the Twins win the division and he called them a "fluke" Then Buherle, Frank, Howry, and several other kept running their mouth.

In 2003, same ol thing. I love how the White Sox was disaparaging the Royals and the Twins and how those two have no chance. Those guys were basically saying that the Twins were done. It didn't work out that way though as the Twins took charge in September especially @ Chicago when the Twins won the last two games. I was very amused at how those guys were talking.

Last year, same ol same ol. Ozzie did lot of whining on Gardenhire. Then those guys went on and on and on about Torii's collision on Jamie Burke. Maybe if Jamie went out of his way, he would have not been barrelled. Torii was going to run. He had no time to think. Stuff happened. That's baseball.
The villiage idiot, Ken Harrelson, spent all month in September whining about the Twins. Frank Thomas talked about how if he and Maggilio were not hurt, they would win the division. When they were healthy, Twins still beat them so that was a stupid thing to say on Frank's part.

This year has not even started and already the nonsense has begun. Their marketing director and Ozzie started whining about the ad that the Twins did in which it featured a lady cleaning the floor with a White Sox jersey. Shouldn't they be worried about their team instead of the Twins? I wrote a thread about this on Friday.

Maybe when the White Sox stop whining and stop talking smack, I will give them their respect and stop bashing them. The same goes to the Cleveland Indians. I don't care for them. They do lot of whining on their own. I got to read the Star-Tribune today and I got to read their village idiot, C.C. Sabathia talk about how he hates the Twins and how he wants to beat them so badly this year.

Go to whitesoxinteractive.com. Those fans hate the Twins too.

[curt4074]

Johan is Chicago's Daddy right now.


I concur... Ends W/ 11Ks... simply amazing when he gets into a groove like he did.... Rincon got us a couple... i think it ended with 13 K's....

(don't quote me on that)

Well, Torii Had a solid night... Had the 3 run bomb... that was a rope... but that DP Ball he served up was lucky to be a FC..then he got that weird Pop-up error... LOL...


reached base on a ball that flew probally 200 feet up..and 3 feet forward...

Lew Ford needs to step up his game...he hasn't really shown much for the twins...


Anyone know what happened to Mauer lately?...He is K'ing more than i have ever seen ... at any level for this kid...

[LesPaul]

timberwolf, i know the resentment that exists but most of us will never know the feeling of competition on that level that leads to the stirred emotions. to go out of the way as fans to act like the players do on occasion seems to me like a yankees-red sox type of rivalry...works great for them but I think a bit out of taste as twins fans IMO. that was the only point i was trying to iron out with "the resentment between the White Sox and Twins", it shouldnt be a thing that elevates to the fans in our forum 'cause in reality it isn't even close to the yankees-red sox type of situation and thats what the thread reminded me of.

[LesPaul]

Well, Torii Had a solid night... Had the 3 run bomb... that was a rope...


indeed. couldn't you sense that one coming? just watchin the game i got the feeling that it was coming seeing how hard they were hittin Buherle and Hunter finally got one to leave the park. i was at a restaurant and just started clapping but I wasn't alone, there was an 8 year old kid clapping as well :D

[Timberwolf]

LesPaul: Maybe you are right. It's just that I am a very passionate Minnesota sports fan as Mark will tell you. I love everything about Minnesota. I know I am not from there, but I do plan on living there. When someone takes a shot at my team or the state of Minnesota, it gets real personal. Fans in general love their team and they are very passionate about them. There is nothing wrong with fans hating the other team. If someone from another team hates the Twins for no reason. I would hope the fans would react like me. When I read today how C.C. hates the Twins, I was so fired up and all. That's the way it should be. Maybe living in NJ rubs off on me in terms of that personality. I mean I am not like Julie or PissedPrincess where my life is revolved into one team that I hate. Julie apparently has an obession of hating the Yankees. I don't think I am her when it comes to hating teams. I won't go on and on and on about how I hate the White Sox.

As for Minnesota sports fans, no offense, but it seems that they don't hate anyone except for the Packers. I know Twins fans hate the White Sox, but they don't get any hostility from the crowd the way the Packers do when they come to Minneapolis. I like to think a good fan will muster hatred towards another team by booing them and talking trash with them. Heck White Sox fans throw stuff at the Twins when the Twins come to town and they booed the Twins at the Cell. I think it's great. Sure I hate my team being booed on the road, but at least it shows that the fans care.

[Timberwolf]

Johan put on a very good show tonight. He vowed the crowd with his pitching performance tonight. He was on fire right away and he just didn't stop. This was a beautiful performance from him. To do it in the sellout crowd is nice. To do it in front of your family is very nice. Johan's mother and father was at the game tonight. It was nice to really see them as they came all the way from Venzeula to see their wonderful son in the mound. It's a special feeling when someone does well in front of their parents or if you do well in front of their parents. I was so happy to see Johan do well in front of his mom and dad. Their parents should be very proud of their son.

Speaking of his parents, it's nice to see Johan's dad with the TC hat. I had a smile on my face when he wore it.

Torii came up big as he always does against Chicago. He hit a three-run HR off Mark Buherle and stole couple of bases. I think in the eighth, he went to steal bases to show the White Sox up because the game was out of hand. It was really good to see him snap out of his funk. He struggled this week, but to his credit, he came through. I hope this is a springboard to a very big season for him which I am expecting.

I tell ya what. It was so good to beat up Buherle AGAIN and Twins fans let him know it at the Dome tonight. I think the Twins have figured him out IMO. In the Twins last three starts against him, they have hit him good especially Torii. This is a very good sign when the Twins face this guy. Buherle is good, but it's not like the Twins should be in awe or scared. They can hit him and they know how to beat him. After years of struggling against Mussina and Buherle, it's good to figure them out.

The bullpen was super too. Juan and Joe did a great job taking care of business. Did you saw how Nathan just stonecold the White Sox? WOW!

Chicago had a 2-0 lead and Johan was hittable in the first, but you just got that feeling tonight that the lead would change. Everytime Johan is on the mound, something good always happens to the Twins. You just knew something good would happen and Torii came through. It's like the Good Lord wants Johan to have that fortune.

The Whiney Sux was whiffing, whiffing, and whiffing away. I would say "He Gone" after the White Sox hitters strikeout. "He Gone" is a phrase that Ken Harrelson would always say whenever the White Sox pitcher strike the other team's hitters out.

Just a great win. It was good not to get swept. Sure it stinks to lose to the White Sox, but it's very early to panic. You just tip your hat to those guys for this weekend. Give them credit as they got it done this weekend. Still as Brad Radke said yesterday, it's April. There is no need to panic.

There is plenty of time to beat Chicago. I think the hitters will start heating up as the season goes on and I expect our infielders to do much better in the field as the season progresses.

[LesPaul]

As for Minnesota sports fans, no offense, but it seems that they don't hate anyone except for the Packers. I know Twins fans hate the White Sox, but they don't get any hostility from the crowd the way the Packers do when they come to Minneapolis.

like i mentioned earlier, its the certain aura of respect Twins fans hold. as far as I know the only time Minnesota fans openly react to opposing fans is the Packers-Vikings matchup, which is acceptable becuase, like the Yankees-Red Sox rivalry everyone knows about it and everyone knows the fans like to try and get under eachother's skin.



I like to think a good fan will muster hatred towards another team by booing them and talking trash with them. Heck White Sox fans throw stuff at the Twins when the Twins come to town and they booed the Twins at the Cell. I think it's great. Sure I hate my team being booed on the road, but at least it shows that the fans care.

Again, I think Twins fans hold themselves to a higher composure. Like recent articles have pointed out, everyone in the Twins system is not in it for the 'me' side of it, they are simply in it for the game. This reflects on the fans as well...why deter from what the players are doing on the field, they are the ones there to prove anything, not the fans. The players know the fans are behind them without having to hear them boo the other team...

[Durango53]

Well said Ryan. I like to think there is a people respect that needs to be upheld. Repect people. It is ok to boo and cheer but to hear people belittle other people is over to top to me. I wasnt a fan of John Elway (for same reason I am not a fan of Eli Manning) but there is that respect of a person that I could never be a ass to him...

But to the game.

Johan could have threw that change up all night long. Holy cow he was all but telling the Sox hitters here is the change up hit if you can. Times throwing it 5 times in a row!!!!! Hell Kernako (sp? 1st basemen of the Sox) that is all he saw the whole game was change ups from Johan. If he has that good of a change up this season we could see things that will be great from Johan.

Ok here is now my take on the 4 catchers thing. Matty should be the third catcher and as what the third catcher should be on a team and that is a emergancy catcher. I am for keeping Corky. I like Redmond but he is a older guy and Joe is looking good and he is telling everyone he is feeling great and I am sure that he is being watched very close by the training staff. I would drop Mike because Corky is younger and I think he would make a good backup. But let Joe go two days and rest the third and run Corky out there. And if something does then happen to both you have Matt who could step in for a game or two until they get one signed or called up. But Joe is looking ok and should be ok.

Now lets talk about something that no one has brought up. Mark and I was talking about this the other day and now it is time to bring it up.
We have heard that the Twins are going to be weaker on the left side of the field on the infield. I think last night that was put to bed and kicked out of the talk. Any SS the Twins have on the field this year is going to be the same or better in the field as Guz but will be much better with the bat. And how about Mike!!!!! He made some outstanding plays last night. Got wild on a throw after an outstanding diving stop that any guy at 3rd would have a very hard time making. Mike was solid and will make everyone forget about Koskie. Had a nice hit last night and should get better as time goes on.

[Timberwolf]

Johan was throwing the same exact pitch, but Chicago could not adapt to it at all.

Like I said, we could have use Terry Tiffee in this series. He may not had helped, but at least he could have gave a presence in the lineup. Having Lecroy as a catcher is more of a waste of roster space as Tiffee did not make the team because of that. I am okay with Redmond and Corky as catchers, but to have Lecroy as a catcher when he is not even a catcher is absurd.

I wrote a thread about the infield defense today as my Twin topic of the day. I think the guys will be okay since Gardenhire and his coaches have the infielders work at it on their defense daily.

[Durango53]

The thing is this is the AL. Where you can carry that extra dead weight that can hit for the DH. LeCroy is a better hitter than Redmond. And even though he might not be that good at catching he can still do it. He is a gamer ask him to do it and he will.

I will take the bat of LeCroy over the glove of Redmond and Tiffee over both in the field. Joe is ok and should be great the way they are playing him right now and keep Corky because he is younger and can fill in better I feel.

[Chisox73]

LesPaul: Maybe you are right. It's just that I am a very passionate Minnesota sports fan as Mark will tell you. I love everything about Minnesota. I know I am not from there, but I do plan on living there. When someone takes a shot at my team or the state of Minnesota, it gets real personal. Fans in general love their team and they are very passionate about them. There is nothing wrong with fans hating the other team. If someone from another team hates the Twins for no reason. I would hope the fans would react like me. When I read today how C.C. hates the Twins, I was so fired up and all. That's the way it should be. Maybe living in NJ rubs off on me in terms of that personality. I mean I am not like Julie or PissedPrincess where my life is revolved into one team that I hate. Julie apparently has an obession of hating the Yankees. I don't think I am her when it comes to hating teams. I won't go on and on and on about how I hate the White Sox.

As for Minnesota sports fans, no offense, but it seems that they don't hate anyone except for the Packers. I know Twins fans hate the White Sox, but they don't get any hostility from the crowd the way the Packers do when they come to Minneapolis. I like to think a good fan will muster hatred towards another team by booing them and talking trash with them. Heck White Sox fans throw stuff at the Twins when the Twins come to town and they booed the Twins at the Cell. I think it's great. Sure I hate my team being booed on the road, but at least it shows that the fans care.

I'll just say this.Yes,White Sox fans boo the Twins like mad,but at the same time,there's a lot of respect for the Twins from White Sox fans.I know.I've seen plenty of games between the 2 teams over the years,going back to '91 when Kent Hrbek was fueding with Hawk Harrleson down the stretch.

Like I said before,don't lump those fans who throw stuff,like you said with the rest of the Sox fans.Yes,we have our ass clowns who only go to the park to cause trouble.But the rest want to see some good hard-nosed baseball betwen the 2 teams.

[Timberwolf]

Chisox: One thing for sure. You are by far one of the most classiest White Sox fan I ever encountered on the web.

Yeah I thought it was funny to see Kent and Hawk go at it. Kent wanted to kill him literally.

Durango: I have to say that Matthew has had a good week as far as his hitting goes. I am going to enjoy as much as I can because that won't last.

[Durango53]

He is a perfect Twins DH. He puts up ok numbers and the Twins can afford him.

If he put up any better numbers he wouldnt be playing with the Twins he would be somewhere else. His D isnt the best but that is ok but it is his bat the Twins want.

He hit .287 two years ago with 17 HR. Last year when he was hurt he hit .269 with 9 hr. Those numbers look a heck of a lot alike the numbers of one of the best DH's in baseball the last year he played with the Twins. Of 20 HR and a avg of .270. He has some power but they have to use him so he can fine tune it so that he might get the numbers of David.

Why didnt you give up on Ortiz? He had some worse numbers than Matt learning and had more years also? You got to give a guy a chance you just cant give him a little time and give up then.

[Chisox73]

Chisox: One thing for sure. You are by far one of the most classiest White Sox fan I ever encountered on the web.

Yeah I thought it was funny to see Kent and Hawk go at it. Kent wanted to kill him literally.

Thanks for the compliment Timberwolf. :thumbsup: You're a real good Twins fan yourself,then again,just about every Twins fan I've ever encountered at US Cellular Field are classy fans.

Anyway,to refresh peoples memories,in the heat of a tight AL West race between the Twins and White Sox in '91,the main thing I remember was that Hrbek had taken offense to Hawk yelling after every strikeout,"Grab some bench!"(That was a good 10 years before "He Gone!")

I was at a double header in mid-September of that year,when this fued was in full swing.In the second game,I believe it was in the 8th inning with the Sox in the lead,Hrbek launches a monster home run to give the Twins the lead in the game.I was sitting behind the Minnesota dugout and when Hrbek finished his grand tour,he looked up toward the White Sox TV booth and pointed to Hawk and said,"You grab some bench!" I thought it was funny. :lmao:

But it ended up being one of the most exciting games I ever saw in person,Carlton Fisk hit a game-tying homer in the 9th inning,then in the 11th,Fisk hit another game-tying shot,and the White Sox won it in the 12th on an infield hit.

As far as opponents are concerned whenever I go see the Sox play,Minnesota is always at the top of my list.

[Timberwolf]

Grab some bench is pretty funny. Better than He Gone.

I don't find that offensive at all.

Kent is a character. One of my favorite Twins. He is also a local boy too from Bloomington, Minnesota.

[Chisox73]

He was my favorite Twin from that era also.

Are you watching the game? Jason Bartlett just hit his 1st ML blast off Maroth.

Joe Mays is looking really good out there tonight.

[Timberwolf]

Chisox: Yes, I am watching the game on MLB.TV. I got my credit card in the mail last night and then I ordered MLB.TV last night. I love MLB.TV. Best thing since the Internet. Now I hope the NBA does the same so I can watch the Timberwolves on the web.

Jason Bartlett hit it deep at the left field stands.

Yes, Joe is looking very good.

Participate in the Bring on the Tigers thread that Durango set for my take on the game.