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yagsy
08-16-2006, 05:07 PM
http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20060816&content_id=1612639&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

08/16/2006 12:00 PM ET
Pirates hope to Motor in Tigers' path
Blossoming talent, guidance of Littlefield have Bucs headed up
By Jim Molony / MLB.com


In six weeks, the Pittsburgh Pirates will finish what will be their 14th consecutive losing season and perhaps the team's second 100-loss season in the last six years.
Pittsburgh has the worst record in the National League, and for the second consecutive year finds itself at the back end of the NL Central. The Pirates haven't had a winning season since 1992, and they haven't come within sniffing distance of .500 since 1999.

You can measure Pittsburgh's problems in any number of ways -- just ask any Pirates fan -- and while this season is certainly another disappointment, there are indications that this long-suffering franchise might finally be on the cusp of turning the corner.

Pittsburghers have heard that before, of course, and there is no doubt that this is a struggling club. But so were the 2003 Tigers, and we all know what they're doing this year.

Like the 116-loss Tigers of three years ago, this year's Pittsburgh team has a smattering of young power arms like Ian Snell, John Grabow and Mike Gonzalez, budding young stars either already arrived -- Jason Bay and Freddy Sanchez -- or on the horizon. A good, young nucleus up the middle in catcher Ronnie Paulino, shortstop Jack Wilson and second baseman Jose Castillo should give Pittsburgh production and stability for the next few years.

The Tigers of 2003 were awful, but they had impressive 20-something pitchers like Jeremy Bonderman, Nate Robertson, Mike Maroth and Fernando Rodney and position players with potential, such as Craig Monroe and Brandon Inge.

The Tigers took their lumps and got better. The youngsters began to blossom, and three years and a few astute free agent signings later, the team is reaping the rewards of its patience and hard work.

The Pirates have a long way to go before they can duplicate Detroit's turnaround, but baseball people around the league are beginning to notice.

Houston manager Phil Garner is among those who don't casually dismiss the Pirates.

"I know they're in last, but they've had some bad luck and injuries," Garner said. "They've gotten better, they've got some good arms on that team and they've got the league's leading hitter [in Sanchez] and Bay is an outstanding player. They can beat you."

The Tigers turned the corner with good young pitching. The youngsters took their lumps early and after a couple of years developed into the kind of staff that has the Tigers in first place today. Of course it helps when some of those young arms are guys like Bonderman and Justin Verlander.

The Pirates have assembled a strong set of arms of their own. Not surprising since Pirates general manager Dave Littlefield was an assistant GM under Tigers president/GM Dave Dombrowski when the two were in the Marlins organization.

"With the exception of [the Mets'] Billy Wagner, there isn't a better lefty reliever in the game [than Gonzalez]," an NL scout said. "They're still two or three players away from .500, but they're a team that could come quickly."

The most encouraging aspect of the Pirates might be their bullpen.

Of the 22 relievers with 20 or more saves this season, only Gonzalez is perfect, having not blown a save opportunity in 21 chances. Every other closer with at least 20 saves has failed to convert at least two save opportunities, and many have blown four or more chances.

Gonzalez has converted a franchise-record 23 consecutive saves since Aug. 16, 2004, the longest such current streak in the Major Leagues.

Gonzalez isn't the only impressive young pitcher on the Pirates. Snell, 24, is 10-8 with a team-high 122 strikeouts. Hard-throwing right-hander Matt Capps, 22, has already made 63 appearances, and several teams would love to have 27-year-old lefty John Grabow. Zach Duke, Paul Maholm and Tom Gorzelanny are potential breakout candidates.

The Pirates are 35-12 when leading after six innings and 38-1 when ahead after eight.

"They pitched very well against us," St. Louis manager Tony La Russa said after the Pirates swept the Cardinals last weekend. "They've got very good players, and they're capable of doing that any night."

Like many teams with a lot of youthful talent, the Pirates have improved as the season has progressed.

Through Sunday, Pittsburgh's team ERA since the All-Star break was 4.02, the sixth lowest in the Major Leagues behind Colorado (3.71), the Los Angeles Dodgers (3.82), Houston (3.84), the New York Mets (3.86) and Minnesota (3.99).

During that span, Pittsburgh's record was 15-13, a mark surpassed by 10 teams: the Mets (18-9), Twins (21-10), A's (20-9), Marlins (17-14), Angels (18-12), Yankees (18-10), Diamondbacks (16-13), Tigers (17-12), Reds (16-13) and Phillies (16-13).

There are a number of significant holes to fill, particularly in the rotation. Another power-hitting outfielder and a first baseman in the event that the projected move of Ryan Doumit to the position doesn't pan out are some of the needs that Littlefield must address.

That's fewer major holes than Detroit had three years ago.

Jim Molony is a writer for MLB.com. This story was not subject to the approval of Major League Baseball or its clubs.

yagsy
08-16-2006, 05:09 PM
I thought this was a great article. It is an up and coming team. I started to take notice late last season. One of the greatest pleasures I have in watching baseball teams is to watch the maturity process...the up and comers build and build slowly to create something amazingly successful! The Pirates are on the right track finally, but it's going to take some patience. :D

redsfan
08-17-2006, 08:19 AM
I have always had a soft spot for them. They were the first game I watched. They played the Reds. Who knows, if they would have won, I could be a long time pirates fan. Two of my all time favorites were Stargell and Parker. Right now I think they are about 2 good bats to turning it around and contending. Their pitching staff also needs a good veteran to help teach the youngsters. This will be a great division if they turn it around too.

Greymire
08-20-2006, 12:17 AM
I read that in our local paper. Unfortunatly, the Buccos seem to play well every August. They did the same thing with McClendon. They play well in ugust, tank in September but say it is because they are looking at youngsters and that August has us hopeful for next year. Then they start out and play well below 500 for 3 months. I can only believe it if they actually make a big free agent signing or two to plug the who;es and then play well next year. I have become a pessimist.

imgreat95
08-20-2006, 12:45 AM
No, no, no, no, and no.

Organizations don't match up; no vets will sign here, unless they are grossly overpaid; no minor system feeding position players; and not clear, yet, if the Piarte minors are feeding capable pitchers.

We sure ain't "Hard Throwers R' Us."

The Tigers did one important thing that they Bucs seem unwilling or unable to do. They overpaid for a superstar.... I am not talkig about overpaying for once above average players like the Pirates have done the past several years. I am talking about a perrenial all-star... By doing so, Tigers management said "we are willing to pay players to come here to build a championship team..." As long as the Nuttings are in charge of the finances, that will never happen here.

Things won't change until owners go, taking Dave Littlefield and Jim Tracey with them--and that's from a fan!!

Now, if you want to compare the Bucs to the Swissvale Patriots Pro League champs........

BPBlueSox
08-30-2006, 06:39 PM
I read that in our local paper. Unfortunatly, the Buccos seem to play well every August. They did the same thing with McClendon. They play well in ugust, tank in September but say it is because they are looking at youngsters and that August has us hopeful for next year. Then they start out and play well below 500 for 3 months. I can only believe it if they actually make a big free agent signing or two to plug the who;es and then play well next year. I have become a pessimist.
That sounds about right!

Baseball Guru
09-20-2006, 03:16 PM
Prates have the 4th best record since the allstar break:thumbsup:

Great turn around... Hopefully they can build on a great 2nd half finish and carry it over to next season...

imgreat95
09-20-2006, 06:13 PM
The only thing that really scxares me is the fact that they sdo this EVERY August ands September.... then come April, they forget how to do it.

Baseball Guru
09-20-2006, 06:50 PM
I know they have played well in August but they have played well in September as well?

Why do you think they start playing well so late in the season but never start off hot?

Greymire
09-22-2006, 08:26 PM
This is the best September they have had in quite sometime. I woould love to think it is a good sign, but I will reserve judgement to see if they make any moves in the off season and how they play next April. They has an article on Eldred on the web again, which makes me think no big moves will be made. It seems like they are ready to try him despite the fact he hasnt played but a few games this year.

ego74
09-22-2006, 10:31 PM
Impressed with how they've played of late, but seems to be the same old story.

2007 comes and this team is 20 games out in July and dumping veterans and rebuilding once again.

Would like to see them field a contender, Lord knows those great fans deserve it

Pittsburghkid
09-29-2006, 05:38 PM
. . . and here comes a 7-game losing streak.

ilikesports1
10-14-2006, 07:20 PM
yay Pittsburgh Pirates!! woohoo! its kinda sad that Pittsburgh has the worst record in the National League...

Baseball Guru
10-15-2006, 07:48 PM
yay Pittsburgh Pirates!! woohoo! its kinda sad that Pittsburgh has the worst record in the National League...

Are you a ****ing idiot or what?